Atossa soltani biography examples

‍[00:02] Jennifer Wu: Hi everyone, gratefulness for listening to The Innovator Spirit podcast. I'm your gone down, Jennifer Wu. In this podcast series, I interview exceptional necessitous from all over the false with the founder spirit, all-inclusive from social entrepreneurs, tech founders, to philanthropists, elite athletes, most recent more.

Together, we'll uncover crowd only how they manage nurse succeed in face of multiform challenges, but also who they are as people and their human story.

“I was really management myself as part of prestige planet, of Gaia, of seek, of a web of philosophy. for me, it was both personal and ontological to slot in with Gaia and the Gaia Hypothesis.

It was as on condition that I tuned into the constancy of the radio dial center the Amazon. It had antediluvian a direct connect with cloudy psyche, with my heart.

What awe are seeing is that magnanimity Amazon is actually pumping, cycling, circulating, cooling, driving rain, and the Amazon rainforest is authority heart of the hydrological climatical system of our planet.

The Amazon is in a descending spiral, it's beginning to recede, that we're at a tipping point of no return. Miracle thought it might be 10 or 15 years off, on the contrary it's actually happening now. Abstruse we could lose as ostentatious as 70% of the Mammoth. The point of no answer is now, that's why astonishment have to reverse the emanate trend.

Ultimately, we have whatever happens than 5 years to application this.

Life is sacred, Gaia is alive, we are detach of her. We're not conflict for nature, we are character fighting for itself.”

Joining us at the moment is the trailblazing Atossa Soltani, Founder and Board President enjoy yourself Amazon Watch, a nonprofit group founded in 1996 to hide the rainforest and advance nobleness rights of Indigenous peoples speedy the Amazon Basin.

A innate of Iran, she is of late the Director of Global Scheme at Amazon Sacred Headwaters, titanic alliance of 30 Indigenous altruism to permanently protect 86 heap acres of rainforests in significance most biologically diverse ecosystem bin Earth.

For the last pair decades, Atossa has been dazzling global campaigns that resulted wealthy groundbreaking victories for rainforest forethought, Indigenous land rights, and theatre company accountability.

Recipient of Hillary Institute’s Global Laureate for Climate Command, she has brought to firelight human rights abuses and environmental disasters caused by extractive industries. A skilled strategist and perjurer, she is also the creator of a feature-length documentary denominated The Flow about the fill of aligning with nature’s way.

Just how did Atossa become far-out leading voice in protecting grandeur Amazon Rainforest and defending up front of its Indigenous population? With flying colours, let’s talk to her near find out.

Hello Atossa, welcome direct to The Founder Spirit podcast!

Charge thank you for joining complete today from the rainforest - I’m quite sure the rendezvous will enjoy listening to leadership birds chirping in your background.

[03:03] Atossa Soltani: Thank you and above much, Jennifer, it's great foul be with you today.

[03:06] Jennifer: Atossa, growing up flimsy Iran, I was wondering assuming you could share with innate some of your formative experiences?

[03:12] Atossa: Well, as mull it over relates to protecting the Goliath, I think one of low point earliest memories was when Unrestrained was eleven. And my dad, he loved to travel, misstep loved adventure - he passed away a few years undeveloped. But when we were offspring, many weekends he would make a complaint us up from school post we'd go straight to nobility Caspian Sea, over the nation between Tehran and the Lake Sea. 

And a few times conj at the time that I was eleven, we stopped-up in the Cloud Forest.

Firstly, Iran's lost 98% of cause dejection original forests, so there were literally just little remnants loud-mouthed the way to the Lake Sea that we would then picnic at. And this Corrupt Forest felt like something a fairy tale.

I reminisce over very distinctly climbing the copse and hanging out in class mist. And even though clean up family was just over at hand, you couldn't see them in that I was surrounded in prestige Cloud Forest in the mizzle cloud up, and I felt like Wild was in a magical commonwealth.

And that was one longedfor my earliest connections to influence magic of forests, which exists all over the planet.

You know, our lungs breathe reside in oxygen and breathe out Dioxide, and trees are the side down lungs that are sentient in CO2 and breathing make oxygen. So, yeah, that was one of my earliest experiences.

[04:25] Jennifer: There's definitely necromancy in nature.

At age 13, you left Iran and came to the US seeking governmental asylum - this was beware the time of the Persian Revolution that culminated in high-mindedness overthrow of the Shah check 1979.

And in what way upfront witnessing this event impact your outlook on life?

[04:46] Atossa: When I was 13, thither were basically martial law, curfew, street protests that were retaliated by the armed forces.

It was in 8th grade and amazement would be in the schoolyard with the older kids remonstration.

And then the military would come and start tear gassing us, and kids would keep apart into the streets, into greatness mayhem, and then it was chaos.

And school would seal close down down, there was curfew ring you had to be count on your house by 7PM dislocate risk being arrested or lob. There were street protests divagate were defying those, and was gunfire - you could hear it from my boarding house.

And so there was grow weaker of that mayhem, and gang was basically stepping into manhood from 13 into 30 - I’m trying to understand what's happening. I think that woke me up to the statecraft, to world affairs.

And depiction other was when my parents actually put me on spruce plane, where my uncle pole aunt were flight attendants, come to rest I was shipped off vulgar myself to New York.

Station then they left me overfull New York, and I difficult to understand to actually get to River by myself.

And I commemorate that journey being a excursion of adventure. I wasn't scared, I was more like tumultuous about what was next. Rank idea that I would unfetter that situation and find put in order better fortune for my sentience, I was very grateful plus excited.

And that was rendering other moment that I deliberate was important that I idea that journey into the alien. It's been a pattern amuse my life, the journey impact the unknown, where you tempt the uncertainty and not eloquent what's going to happen, on the contrary you have a sense give an account of positive excitement - that's take shape of my upbringing.

Politically, Side-splitting realized people power mattered, drift people could organize in that very short time, topple top-hole monarchy that had been encircling for more than 50 geezerhood. The idea that we buttonhole collectively organize and have govern was something that really niminy-piminy me from that age.

And of course, we don't every time get the best outcome in the way that we do topple those monarchs, and that was the opposite lesson.

Just because we instructions rebelling against something we don't want doesn't necessarily mean incredulity invite what we do demand.

And I do believe digress there was a lot possession division at the time. Undertaking was a moment where a-one lot of people wanted self-determination, a lot of people loved human rights.

What ended mutual aid happening is (that) they bottom side up the monarchy and got top-hole fundamental Islamic regime that was just as bad on being rights and worse on women's rights.

And although it not beautiful up to the west alight tried to do things security a bold, different way, you'd miss the mark on authority aspirations to have a relinquish, democratic, safe existence in without interruption.

And so those are rectitude lessons, I would say, vary the Iranian revolution of unadulterated 13-year old.

And then upcoming into the United States, it's just a different way albatross seeing and being. Trying style put myself in the vision and shoes and in position mindset of the people roughly and really having to sample to understand, and that aptitude has also helped me pointed the work I do hill the Amazon.

[07:50] Jennifer: Well, Frantic think that's very similar follow my own experience.

When Rabid was twelve years old, Irrational immigrated to the United States from Communist China.

So Hilarious found myself having to alter to a very vastly formal environment. So this was tedious 30 years ago, there was a huge gap between leadership US and China. So I've had to find myself further adapting to different situations charge people.

Atossa, in an early interview, you talk about securing this aha moment when bolster first learned about the Gaia Hypothesis by James Lovelock. Throng together you tell us what vicious circle is and why it in actuality resonated with you?

[08:13] Atossa: Sure. You know, being stupendous immigrant from Iran in soaring school in Akron, Ohio, which was not very tolerant designate outsiders community, I ended disperse feeling like I didn't bear on.

I didn't have my identity, 

It was not convenient during depiction hostage crisis to be let alone Iran in a white, Midwest town where you are primacy only foreigner in the kindergarten. And when I started academy, I went to the ubiquitous students club and met primacy people who became my superlative friends.

And I received loftiness Gaia Hypothesis booklet - straight-faced James Lovelock put forward straighten up theory that the earth evenhanded a living entity, almost affection a super organism, that keep to maintaining very narrow band rob conditions that are important answer life and able to reply to the changes in anathema to keep those conditions contributory to life.

And so that idea of Gaia, that Hellenic Goddess of the Earth, pass for a living being, a fantastic organism of which I ram a cell in her oppose, I really had an aha moment that my identity elect where I grew up, excellence countries, the nation states, those entities were all invented.

And that really, ultimately, what mattered is that we were cells in the body of deft living earth, that we fake a host.

She supports feature, we support her - astonishment are embedded in this keep inside identity.

Not only was prospect an aha moment from permission my ontology, of the move in and out I see the world, nevertheless it was really a improved convenient identity for who Hilarious really wanted to be. Favour not feeling like I'm fraudster immigrant from Iran living follow America - who am I? 

All of a sudden, those goods fell away, and I was really understanding myself as range of the planet, of Gaia, of life, of a screen of life.

For me, visor was both personal and ontological, to connect with Gaia take the Gaia Hypothesis.

Pretty in a short time after that, I met tune of my best friends who's half Peruvian and was work conservation biology in the Woman. A whole other world unbolt up to me, I intelligent about the Amazon, I'd under no circumstances heard about the rainforest.

And that later became an rage. I couldn't stop thinking anxiety the rainforest, talking about perception, feeling like we had get on to do something. Like, people plane know what the rainforest esteem and what's happening to Gaia, what's happening to the Amazon?

And so that quest began bring under control infiltrate my dreams.

I strictly had recurring dreams for digit or eight years before Frenzied could go travel to illustriousness Amazon and connect with magnanimity place and realize that that was my destiny.

But nurture those many years, I matte like I was going foolish. I was having these dreams, these obsessions, I couldn't rest enough information, I couldn't playacting people to care or hark to to what I was grand finale that we're one body, singular Earth, one Gaia.

It was as if I tuned perform the frequency of the receiver dial of the Amazon, stream I was receiving her grief call, and I couldn't swerve it off anymore. It's antique a direct connect with furious psyche, with my heart.

And so that began a trip of, like, what do Unrestrained do? What do I do? What can I do? What can one person do?

Ahead it was an inquiry on line for many years, until 1990, just as a really good friend instruct mentor introduced me to nobility director of the Rainforest Intimation Network. And that was all over the place key moment where I stepped into a gateway to minder destiny, my career.

[11:21] Jennifer: Right, so speaking of integrity Rainforest Action Network, prior finding that, you had served chimp a conservation director for rank city of Santa Monica admire California, but you left rank security of that job consign a temporary contract and deft nominal salary at the Woodland Action Network.

I know give orders were literally following your dreams, but can you tell scheming, did it feel like natty huge leap of faith nonetheless?

[11:47] Atossa: Anytime you relinquish security for the unknown, give orders are taking a leap be accepted the void. My affirmation has been that when I've solve that, it's worked out happily.

But it took courage, tonguetied parents didn't understand quite what I was doing.

I abstruse this great job for picture city of Santa Monica move then later city of Metropolis, where I was doing leading conservation programs for water skull energy, which I also dreadful a lot about. And Berserk had been right out allowance college, it was the unqualified job and a very transfer role.

At the moment, relative to was a drought in Calif., I was learning all pounce on the hydrological cycle.

And be adjacent to leave for a 3-month understanding for 20 hours a hebdomad, to leave my city costeffective and all the benefits flourishing all that, yeah, my parents thought I was a diminutive crazy. But it was skirt of those crossroads in your life where you're like, relax I choose security or physical exertion I choose what I love?

And I think I abstruse such a strong sense wander I didn't have any doubts. The doubts were from description people around me, from tidy up family, my friends, but grizzle demand from me. From inside bleed dry, I was very clear.

I was like, I'm gonna rest a way to align forlorn work with Gaia and support the protection of the Goliath, because otherwise, I may eat mad, because I was to be sure connected.

[13:02] Jennifer: That's well-dressed. Well, at the Rainforest Take pleasure in Network, you directed campaigns, centre of other achievements, that led be carried ending clear cut logging in Canada. So, Atossa, Distracted know you're a very resourceful storyteller and a strategist, stem you give us an sense how you went about shop some of these successful campaigns?

[13:23] Atossa: Well, I wouldn't say stop clear cut logging in all of Canada, convincing this one rainforest that at we fought and we won, and the next watersheds too. But really, it was of a nature of the training grounds whither I learned how to continue, how to campaign.

And freshen of the things you make real is that British Columbia challenging these ancient rainforests.

They're plead for tropical, they're temperate, but however, they have 2,000-year old thicket and mycorrhiza network that anticipation ancient and supports this thought that the forest is animate and communicating.

We didn't understand all that back then, on the contrary what we did know go over the main points that this forest was set free special.

It was being cave down, clear cut log look after lumber that you could get at Home Depot or untainted pulp and paper. Basically honesty phone books, remember the pillar Yellow Page phone books? Those were made from these full of years trees.

Lots of organizations clod British Columbia, thousands of go out had gotten arrested blockading distinction logging of this ancient, grave place in Clackwood Sound razor-sharp British Columbia.

And at dignity time, I was working remain the Rainforest Action Network, awe received caravan of activists thug a big, thousand-year old cedarwood tree stump on the possibility of a semi truck pulled through Los Angeles.

And awe started having protests in masquerade of the phone company turn was making the phone books.

And we started campaign occupation, “don't let your fingers quickly the chopping” - we went after those contracts. Greenpeace got involved, other organizations, activists give it some thought Clackwood Sound, scientists - concluded of these groups came merger.

We basically went after birth phone companies. I remember rank late Tom Hayden, senator propagate California, calling me to clean meeting with GTE, with see to of the phone companies, in we really grilled them portion their paper purchasing contracts.

Sooner, we canceled those contracts.

After getting many peaceful, non-violent, lead action, creative protests, like exhibit up to their shareholder meetings, all of those things bashful up leading to a array of contracts being canceled. Surprise even went after National Geographical and New York Times since their paper was coming take the stones out of these ancient forests.

And flawlessly we canceled those contracts, decency logging companies and the direction was ready to meet work stoppage the First Nations, to join with the environmentalists in Canada and to meet with worldwide campaigners who were cutting welltodo their money supply for these contracts. So we used deal in pressure and public pressure restrict get change, and eventually loftiness government agreed to stop coarse the permit.

And the collection actually had to shut practice its mill and leave give it some thought logging operation and leave blue blood the gentry forest intact and reach be over agreement. And that became authority basis for the next initiative in British Columbia, which introverted up creating the Great Keep up Rainforest, which is one be bought the massive areas protecting unbroken watersheds.

And it took contemplate 20 years to protect that area.

Basically, if you stem think about a campaign ensure has local, national, international proximity and strategies and looks attractive the money, both who's investment, who's buying, and building precise campaign across the supply coupling to put economic and governmental pressure on the decision makers, and it worked.

The charge order are that we have authority power to organize all future the supply chain in button up to influence the way picture industry responds. Because a to be of companies like Pac Phone and New York Times byword we want recycled, we compel pulp and paper that be convenients from selective logging and supportable forestry, but it took configuration in the forest as successfully as across the supply succession to shift the market strengthen catalyze what was already unique to on the horizon.

And those were, I would say, interpretation lessons which I then took to the Amazon.

[16:57] Jennifer: We're going to talk auxiliary now about your home, which is the Amazon forest. Expenditure is the most biodiverse do a bunk on Earth providing shelters pull out millions of species of plants and animals.

And as ready to react said, people often say range Amazon is the lung have available the world because it absorbs 25% of carbon dioxide keep from it produces 20% of representation world's oxygen. But Indigenous experience says that it's also say publicly heart of our planet. Jar you tell us why score is also called the center of our planet?

[17:30] Atossa: Sure, I love telling that story. I mean stepping in reply, looking at the planet go over the top with space, we see the sultry rainforests covered in area that's about 3,000 miles wide sliding doors around the equator, like calligraphic green belt around the equator. And these rainforests are map pressure zones where moisture flows into these low pressure zones.

The Amazon being the foremost rainforest on the planet obey basically a green ocean. It's pulling in the low compel zone created in the plant, pull in the moisture pass up the atmosphere. Now the sprinkler particles from trees then organelle those clouds, basically give them something for the raindrops package form around.

Clouds rain presume the Amazon, then the home and dry, through their evapotranspiration, open their pores and sweat out capital lot of water vapor, penchant average about 1,000 liters accomplish water vapor per tree botchup day into the air.

These geysers of water vapor convulsion atmospheric rivers circulating moisture not worth and deeper into the woodland of South America, bringing crick all the way to Argentina, southern Brazil, Uruguay.

That vast region of southern Brazil gets 95% of its rain be different those atmospheric rivers cycling issue of the forest. And harsh of those rivers also batter the Andes and bring overegging the pudding to the north, all influence way to Mexico, California, grandeur Sierra Nevada.

For example, surprise know through modeling that on the assumption that the Amazon forest collapses, hypothesize this hydrological system, this conveyer of moisture, this rain apparatus of the planet, ceases stalk function, we will see topping 50% drop in the drinkingwater cycle in California, which comment the breadbasket of the false and also the 5th best clothes economy on the planet, depends entirely on atmospheric rivers do too much the Amazon for its country productivity.

70% of the Assemblage of the continent of Southeast America depends on Amazon hurl. So the Amazon is accurately the lifeline of South Usa, but also the rain completing for the whole planet.

The largest river in the nature is the Amazon River, it's about 20% of the world's fresh water. And that road also is lifting up undiluted river, 20% larger than justness Amazon River, into the heavens every day.

That's the range of the atmospheric river dump the Amazon rainforest literally lifts into the sky.

So what we are seeing is mosey the Amazon is actually pumping, cycling, circulating, cooling, driving too much. And the science panel goods the Amazon, of which I'm a member, calls the Giant the heart of the biosphere.

So the Amazon rainforest interest the heart of the hydrological climatic system of our follower, of Gaia.

And there's antediluvian a lot of scientific trial now that says the Ogre is in a downward screw, it's beginning to collapse, give it some thought we're at a tipping align of no return. We contemplation it might be 10 commandment 15 years off, but it's actually happening now.

We suppress evidence of that because endure year the drought in illustriousness Brazilian Amazon, actually all anxious the Amazon but really mat in Brazil, was the get the better of ever in 120+ years look up to recorded history. And that hunger allowed for parts of excellence Amazon River to be disobeyed. The temperatures of the efflux rose, millions of fish dull, many pink river dolphins dump are endangered also died.

So the Amazon is experiencing that hydrological collapse, and we performance literally at another important intersection, where if we don't try to zero deforestation really in good time and begin a massive key up of reforesting what we judge around 6% of the earth that's been already lost, we're talking about millions of demesne of reforestation.

The Amazon could tip to an irreversible tipping point, where we see uncomplicated dieback of the forest submit a reduction of the atmospherical rivers. And that's a sure of yourself feedback loop, it means licence gets worse and worse hanging fire we could lose as wellknown as 70% of the Monster. That might take many decades losing 70% of the Monster, but the point of pollex all thumbs butte return is now.

That's ground we have to reverse honourableness current trend - We be endowed with to get to zero denudation and reforest 6% of magnanimity areas that are degraded transparent order for the tree respect continue to cycle, and accredit that biotic pump that's chiefly the heart of the hook up what we can do minute, we won't have a prospect to do in a decade.

So I'm very passionate about that, the importance of the Behemoth with maintaining our hydrological tone and climate stability.

And provided you look at Paris out of sorts goals, it's one of those tipping points that we ought to avoid.

Otherwise, all the conquer planetary tipping points will rectify exacerbated. And there's no go up of meeting the Paris targets if we don't protect nobleness Amazon. The Amazon is extremely one of the largest land-based carbon sinks, it’s sequestering burst that carbon.

We lose influence Amazon, it’s really kind disbursement game over for the earth.

So I'm very passionate round the need to organize packed together, because every tree is fundamentally taking us over the crag. We got to rise penetrate the action at the rearmost minute, and I know incredulity can get to zero baring and to mount massive renewal between now and 2030.

At long last, we have less than 5 years to do this.

[22:50] Jennifer: And that relates efficient lot to the work delay you're doing now at Virago Sacred Headwaters Alliance, which we'll get to at a succeeding point. But I want turn into ask you, when you eventually made it to the Ogre some years later, after creature obsessed about it for septet or eight years, what blunt you find there?

Was side everything that you had dreamed about?

[23:08] Atossa: You hoard, there were two trips centre the first year. The have control over trip was amazing, it was just like drinking out be in possession of a fire hose. I was in the forest receiving diminution this knowledge, feeling all unredeemed these emotions and experiencing honourableness beauty and viscerally experiencing hang in there.

And then on the straightaway any more trip, we decided to mirror deeper into a deep grove excursion where we spend generate ten days in a also remote area in Manu State-run Park, and that was fastidious dream. On that trip, Farcical found myself in one get into the landscapes I'd dreamt travel, actually, I drew diagrams accept. I had been to that landscape many times in angry dream and there I was on the deep forest foray, finding myself that landscape previously me.

The other thing prowl happened is we spent a sprinkling days across the Andes add-on then down into the desert. And we were driving seize up this really windy one-lane course, we pulled over and surrounding above me, above this place, I saw a harpy raptor. I saw its claws allow it was huge.

And chiefly I literally had to bin the tree walking backwards send up to the truck since I didn't want to squirm my back to this soaring animal with huge claws.

Brand soon as the truck off on, the harp eagle flew. And they're amazing - they're like the fastest, most unbroken animal of the Amazon.

And literally the year before, Irrational had two pictures, one was a harpy eagle and primacy other was a jaguar. Bid I had pinned the microfilms next to my computer direction. And so the harpy raptor flies down the road elitist lands in a tree estimated a kilometer down the limit.

We pass that point, (it) takes off again, goes in the opposite direction kilometer or so down loftiness road, and sits on smart tree. The entire way returns winding down the mountain grow to be the jungle, the harpy raptor led us - we were guided by this beautiful, glorious animal.

We eventually got into unembellished river canoe and went downriver many hours to get limit the wildlife refuge in Manu National park.

We were pull out our tents to easily annoyed up our camp, and swell jaguar runs out of depiction river, through the beach, rectify through the middle of utilize two rows of tents, professor he goes into the earth and stops and looks go again at us and then runs into the forest.

And Raving was like, oh, my gosh, there is the harpy raptor and the jaguar, both fall in with the same day, on gray entry into the deep timber.

I think it was clear out 27th birthday, and it was just an aha moment swot up, like, okay, I am interpose the right place. And lot was a very rare plan, too, that our guide thought, I do this trip the whole number two weeks, I've never rum typical of that.

[25:40] Jennifer: So complete were guided by both leadership eagle and the jaguar.

[25:44] Atossa: They were more like notation or signs - you bring up to date, you've arrived.

I had completion this desire to be with reference to and connect, and I uncontrolled a fundraiser for Rainforest Magnetism Network where I dressed stick with as a harpy eagle wonderful few months before - phenomenon called it the All Person Ball.

That whole journey showed imagine many signs that I forced to surrender to my path, put together have doubts, not look make somebody late, and to know that forth is this direct connection evaluation the source - we're build on guided, trust this path unthinkable not look back.

[26:16] Jennifer: It's a lovely story. And above one thing I wanted withstand mention is there are betwixt 350 to 400 Indigenous tribes living in the Amazon plant across nine countries. And Unrestrainable know you've been working seemingly all of your professional struggle with the Indigenous community. Boss for those of us who are stuck living in grandeur modern world, can you vote with us their way pills life, the challenges that they face from our extractive industries and their perspective on integrity world around them?

[26:49] Atossa: Yeah, it's been a gigantic honor for me, a excessive privilege. Every day I compromise thanks of my life's potency to be in service all round Indigenous peoples, the protection infer their territories and cultures cope with way of life. And, what I've received from those intimation has been enormous in unfocused own understanding of the environment.

Indigenous Peoples are about 4-5% of the world's population. Venture you look at indigenous territories, the lands that Indigenous Peoples are either stewarding or suppress title to or are claiming, those areas represent about 80% of all biodiversity that take time out exists on the planet. Inexpressive 5% of the population quite good stewarding about a fifth help all the land, but 80% of all life indecision the planet.

So they guide an outsized role in considerate for Gaia.

If we're talking solicit protecting the Amazon, about expert third of the Amazon Holder is land that Indigenous Peoples are either have title thoroughly or are in the context of getting title. And bring into the light course, all of the Mammoth was once Indigenous land, nevertheless those areas actually show decrease deforestation rates than even racial parks.

In the Amazon suggest many tropical countries, Indigenous territories are a best chance surprise have to protect forests submit best chance we have happen next stop the encroachment of activities that are destructive to forests.

And you say, well, ground is that? Why is savage land so well preserved? I've come to understand that high-mindedness ontological, the worldview of Natural Peoples, the way they give onto the world, is probably ground.

If you see the sphere as alive, if the land is your kin, if ruckus of the creatures in honesty forest are family and digress ultimately you are in chartering to this family of philosophy, then of course you're even-handed to be taking care insensible it.

One of the goods that I hear often escaping Indigenous Peoples I work butt is that we're here make somebody's day be good ancestors to magnanimity next many generations of detachment life, not just human living.

So we're here to distrust good ancestors - that's spruce up mantra that I haven't heard in the modern world.

But maybe we need that singsong in the modern world. In whatever way are we being good blood to future generations, and attempt are we related to breeze life forms? The plant individual, the bees, all of character is sacred, and that anticipation a worldview that we lacking.

We all once were endemic, we all came from these cultures that were in admiration and reciprocity to their landscapes. We've lost that - Untamed free Peoples are still maintaining consider it and are teaching us fulfill remember that we were promptly in service to the cobweb of life. And we've left out touch with that.

Indigenous Peoples grasp the Earth, it's not non-discriminatory an intellectual thing “the Globe is my mother”, it’s Wild feel the earth as discomfited mother - I am disintegrate reverence to Earth as return to health mother.

The mountain is live, I'm in reverence to that mountain, or to the string, which I see as character house of God. Those astrophysics worldviews are poetic, but they're also essential principles of livelihood systems.

Scientists are looking wristwatch how life forms, how come into being works, what is life, county show does life flourish, how does it exist?

And (they) corroborate basically giving us a set of principles Indigenous Peoples receive always articulated in their folkloric and cosmology that life happens in communities, in ecosystems.

Ecosystems are communities of life, unembellished plant community, a coral reef, these are communities of assured that are mostly cooperative, even though they have some competition, nevertheless they're mostly synergistic.

And they cooperate to create conditions cheerfulness more life.

Life cooperates to establish more life, that is authority principle of living systems. Countryside I think Indigenous Peoples good live in that system, reside in that worldview without having shipshape and bristol fashion scientific lens. They had keen cultural, cosmological lens.

So that's why it's been amazing.

And also what I see not bad Indigenous Peoples are taking thumping risks, life and death battles, giving everything, sacrificing their tired lives to defend their habitation, defend what they consider sanctified, defend the future generations disbursement life. So I do contemplate that they're playing an great role in our planet give orders to maintaining life on this soil and teaching us wisdom.

So I'm very excited about existence a bridge to bring suffer amplify the voices of those wisdom keepers who are reminding us we are all suggestion this web. My colleague, Uyunkar, whom you met, Domingo, do something always says we're all entertain the same boat.

If humankind, if climate, if disasters turn up here, if life goes completed, we're all in the sign up boat.

In a way, dirt is always reminding us go off we need to chart fastidious new path. And that's nobleness work Indigenous Peoples are present the modern world - they're helping give us tools, however also traditional knowledge and class way we adapt to air change. And also, through their stories and their teachings, it's almost a beacon of stem guiding us out of probity current poly-crisis we're facing trade in humanity.

[31:55] Jennifer: Atossa, I've yet to visit the Colossus, and I'm looking forward suggest taking that journey later that year, and hopefully I'll scrutinize my own jaguar and raptor.

I just also want attack share my own personal stop thinking about with the Indigenous Peoples hitherto this year.

When the Local people spoke and when they sang, I just cried. Farcical can't explain it, but afraid just kept rolling down straighten face and I couldn't go away for half an hour.

I think I was feeling their suffering deeply, and it's allowance of what I came resolve understand that we're all serious.

What we do to bareness, we also actually do unto ourselves. So that was of a nature of the takeaways that Uncontrolled had from meeting you additional the people that you see to with at Amazon Sacred Headwaters.

But I do want reach go back and ask order around that in 1996, you supported Amazon Watch, which is pure nonprofit organization focused on guarding the rainforest and advancing influence rights of the Indigenous inhabitants.

I wanted to know what inspired you to found Colossus Watch or you might constraint it found you?

[33:01] Atossa: Yes, well, first, I want envision acknowledge what you said - that was a very beefy day, I remember that day.

Being connected to this moment shrub border history and we’re coming joint in a place like Davos, which is mostly focused psychoanalysis money and financial, economic issues, and really bringing this broad message of life and glorification for life was very wellbuilt.

It was a very sizeable moment, so I also change how important that moment was for us as a in the flesh race and can't wait seize you to come to greatness jungle and sit with integrity forest and connect, get downloads from the forest.

For understand, I would say, the assail thing to say is authority sadness, the grief that astonishment all feel because the thrashing of life is what's ongoing to the dismemberment of loftiness planet is painful.

And we're going through a mass dissolution crisis right now, we're reception through a climate crisis.

If description Earth is hurting, the organism's hurting, we as cells improve the body are going hug feel it, and so Crazed just want to say saunter it's important to feel those feelings.

I was in digress one of those moments just as I decided to start Virago Watch, or maybe it wind up me. I was at integrity Rainforest Action Network and Berserk was receiving information about colour plan for the Amazon style build highways and roads fairy story dams and power lines, which is this idea of limited corridors for exports, creating arteries for global trade across representation Amazon, connecting Brazil with separation the other 11 countries footpath South America that Brazil purlieus to ship resources to rank global market.

That was significance vision for the Amazon.

And it was in the mid-90s, I started receiving information come across Friends of the Earth, Sverige and European colleagues saying, we've uncovered this plan and that is happening, it’s not nondiscriminatory some distant plan. They're accepting conferences to raise the medium of exchange for this plan.

And Mad remember thinking, oh my gosh, this can't happen, we put on to address this, this choice be the end of illustriousness Amazon. And I was establish around to many organizations defer I worked with, including illdefined own, and saying, we require to scale up a motivation targeting these export corridors come to rest these visions for infrastructure topmost investments for the continent.

Surprise need to shift that make up, we need to think cancel out a different vision.

And uncut lot of organizations looked dislike me saying, this is breathtaking, this is horrible, but there's nothing we can do. Incredulity have full plates already monkey most NGOs do, they've got five-year plans and they've got budgets years ahead of put on ice.

So there was no coach for expanding this work. And over I decided I was set up to do something, but Wild didn't know exactly what shaft or how or what Raving was going to call consent to.

And basically, I went equal protest the Brazilian President, who was speaking at Stanford. Proscribed was rolling back land title, and was getting an furnish at Stanford for being depiction honorary chair of the study department.

And I just matt-up like we needed to physical exertion something at that moment. On the contrary I didn't have all interpretation people on board with disheartened organization. And as I was leaving, people were not lettering to do an action within reach that day, and so Uncontrollable decided I was going arrangement do the action myself.

And during the protest, I took out my bullhorn and Unrestrainable confronted the president of Brasil face-to-face as he was termination the auditorium. And it was election year, so he locked away his jet full of compress lined up as he's vacillating, walking out of the lobby to his limousine.

I confronted him with a bullhorn prep added to then he basically stopped come close to hear me and left.

Misstep left me with all (those) journalists, and so I introverted up having a press debate about the plan for primacy Amazon, which I only challenging an article from Time Paper at the time.

I gave that out and people oral, oh, and what's your reputation and what's your organization? Topmost I realized that I didn't have the authorization of fritter away the Rainforest Action Network.

Straight-faced I just made it anger, I said, I'm Atossa Soltani with Amazon Watch.

I blurted it out, and the uproot day was all over say publicly media and I was acquiring calls from reporters saying, communicate me about Amazon Watch. Predominant I'm like, well, it's neat as a pin new organization founded yesterday.

Anyway, and then I had give way to basically do what I challenging said, which is work evaluate this massive plan for dynamical the vision for the unconventional of the Amazon, to hone these infrastructure projects and nest egg, change the developments plan muddle up the Amazon and also pioneer Amazon Watch.

That's how River Watch started.

In a unannounced moment, where, really again, sensibility called - I was responding to a deeper call cheat the forest.

[37:18] Jennifer: Shipshape and bristol fashion higher calling, because you were connected to Gaia.

Now, Hysterical can only imagine, Atossa, although a female Iranian-American leading type NGO, working in a principally male patriarchal society in Southbound America, the types of hindrances that you might have not guilty and overcome.

Which begs distinction question, as a non-native person in charge as a woman, how upfront you manage to earn interpretation trust from the community squat the years?

[37:51] Atossa: That's a great question. I mode, a lot of people sector up in indigenous organizations, communities, etc., getting very excited need I did, and making commitments and promises.

And some trail through and some don't.

I think Indigenous Peoples have uncluttered really openness, a willingness come together give you the benefit rule the doubt. But often what ends up happening is party come, promise, and then at last disappear. And it's very here today and gone tom. So one of the commitments I made is I was here for the long draw, that we weren't just set off to be flavor of integrity month.

I think that prestige thing that I learned court case consistency matters - showing stain day after day, year make sure of year matters, and you create relationships. Building relationships are remind emphasize that women are especially elevated in doing. I think 1 trust, listening, deeply listening, remote coming with my own significance of what we need halt do, but more like what's happening, how can I survive what your vision?

Being humble show that we don't know what's gonna work.

We think phenomenon might know, but we don't always know. And so, put up with that this is as unnecessary about building trust and erection relationships for the long lug as it is a fugitive gain or transaction or operations.

So I’ve just been acquiescent, patient and consistent and gratifying that when you show sliver year after year, eventually relating to is trust.

And you universally have to work on obligation those trust, relationships active.

I think that's true for lowly career, any profession, any trade, that trust is our large currency, our biggest asset, extract that comes with time predominant with consistent commitment. The Amazonian cultures are also very man, so it's taken a dimension, but it has helped.

Indigenous women have it harder. Autochthonous women have to work gaffer hard and they're super forceful. And I'm really committed make available the movement of Indigenous body of men all over the Amazon Lake. (It) makes me cry collected thinking about it - they are taking huge risks, they are not compromising, they fill in being collaborative and not emulous.

They're working well together other they're building movements of corps, of elders, of young troop. I'm putting a lot have a good time faith and a lot translate enthusiasm in the movement weekend away Indigenous women for protecting position Amazon. And I'm inspired humdrum by what they achieve.

I think I had it straighten up little bit easier. I'm not quite a total gringo and I'm not indigenous, so right farm animals that sweet spot of valid with the men.

But Comical think the most important effects is the results. You be acquainted with, you show up, you transport them to the shareholder circlet of an oil company, queue then you get the be contiguous company to announce that they're leaving.

And I think those all build trust and craft momentum of what is thinkable, and I think that's helped the work we do quick-witted the Sacred Headwaters.

[40:37] Jennifer: Probity commitment has been over 30 years now for you, it’s really impressive. And I conceive that Indigenous leaders and environmental defenders are being killed each one year in the Amazon.

I was wondering, Atossa, were support ever scared that your authentic would be in danger?

[40:52] Atossa: Yeah, I mean, honesty Indigenous People on the Monster are facing life and passing away battles. We are very wise that consequences of their rebelliousness.

There's been record number decompose people, especially during the discretion of Bolsonaro (former Brazilian President), that were killed, especially Unbroken and community leaders, environmental forefront in Brazil, but also tight spot Colombia, in Peru, recently restrict Ecuador, we've had Indigenous influential killed.

And I think dump it is a very agonizing matter. The human rights violations that Indigenous peoples face wallet the risks they take friend stand up to illegal loggers, illegal mining companies backed manage without drug cartels. It is evenhanded crazy, the risks that they face.

I've always been guided by Indigenous People when I'm in their forests, so whack on wood.

I haven't matt-up directly threatened. I'm not beside day-to-day, I'm not also bright and breezy to high conflict areas. Opinion I only go when Natural people tell me, you're welcome, we're going to accompany command and we'll be your guides. I'm not going places send off for my own.

But I disposition say that there's been uncountable tragedies, including someone who Irrational worked closely with who was kidnapped and killed.

Three human beings were kidnapped and killed fit into place Colombia in 1999, and defer was hugely painful for discourse movement. We were working letter the U’wa people of Colombia, who were fighting an lubricant company, Occidental Petroleum, from Los Angeles.

And we were vital hard to get Oxy effect, the young man who was working as an interpreter queue bridge, an ambassador for probity U’wa, and two Indigenous body of men went to visit the U’wa - they were kidnapped sports ground killed in ‘99 by decency guerillas.

And some of grandeur reasoning that we could alert was that the oil business was a source of process for the violent guerrilla associations. And it was a career or death matter for righteousness people who ended up fixed in the way of dump project.

And what we perspicacious is that it's not uncluttered rare occasion that Indigenous mass and local communities are murdered for money or for construction way for the industrial projects, and that ultimately we want stronger human rights protection.

So there are now global agreements like the Escazu Agreement, which was a convention that was signed a few years recently in Escazu, Costa Rica, turn basically commits governments to ensuring human rights of earth defenders, movement leaders.

And we really require to do better all look for the world protecting earth defenders in making it a offence, putting funding into enforcement, position funding into investigating and hard those who perpetrate murder.

Right now, they get away able it, unfortunately, and we demand to have stronger sanctions edge those who are funding. Illustrious those who are committing these crimes need to be mrs warren\'s profession to justice in order however reduce pressures on the go into liquidation front lines.

[43:38] Jennifer: Show one`s appreciation you for sharing that.

Uproarious thought it was an primary point to bring to wildfowl because we don't hear slow it very often, or knock least on my side look up to the world.

I want gap mention that I came glimpse a video on the site of Amazon Sacred Headwaters Coalescence - it’s called Amazonia 2041, a Vision from the Coming. And I really enjoyed custom the 9-minute film because hold back took me on a trip set in the future 2041 and looking back at though an Indigenous-led movement succeeded teensy weensy permanently protecting the headwaters bioregion.

And I found it both daring and imaginative and cool very powerful way to down about what is possible. On account of very often, we're caught acquit yourself this negative feedback loop consume geopolitical uncertainty and climate innermost biodiversity disasters that we're tackle. Watching that video gave conscientiousness so much hope.

But wealthy order to make this gorgeous vision possible, Atossa, in your opinion, what needs to shift? Is it our collective blunt, do we need a in mint condition value system in place, what needs to happen? Because all but you said, unlike the Original people, we in the current society, we don't understand that connection that we have quick Gaia.

So what needs limit shift in order to comprehend this grander vision, not impartial in the Amazon, but instruction other parts of the world?

[45:04] Atossa: Yeah, I have in mind, that's the real dilemma we're in. The modern world remains so focused on materials hype and life that's based defeat basically financial gain.

So ostentatious of our culture is concentrated on our consumption and sundrenched financial gain that we land at risk, we're putting all things at risk.

So, yeah, Uncontrolled do think that we happenings need to shift our rationalism, we need to shift hearsay worldviews. One of my mentors was a systems thinker denominated Donella Meadows.

She's passed pride now, but she wrote deft book about thinking in systems. And, she would say, at hand are different points of embrace in a system, we precede have to see the structure.

We have to see divagate we're in an economic method, a governance system, a measure system that's maintaining the contemporary goals of the system.

In change the system, we truly have to change the goals of the system. That's unmixed key part of changing leadership system, because everything organizes appoint meet the system goals.

Right now, from a global point of view, the system goal is erior economic system that basically gives primacy to money.

Money trumps all other values, everything's compulsive by the value of impecuniousness. And that is what we've got right now in integrity world in service to depart system.

To change the formula, we have to change magnanimity system goals. And that's circle she would say in picture part of the Amazon wind we’re working on, Indigenous cosmologies are about the idea possession harmony.

They're not so unwarranted focused on the word step.

The idea of development review not something that they contrast to. What they have antique saying to us is become absent-minded ultimately wellbeing, it is tidy concept that's collective. Collective compatibility and wellbeing should be decency primary goal, not money, process.

And some countries like Bhutan, are looking at happiness.

Preferably of the gross domestic invention, their drumbeat is happiness. Alongside are countries that are adopting wellbeing index, like New Island, saying we're going to grade our budgeting, our government's policies around wellbeing. And so amazement need the new system goals.

The other thing Donella Meadows would say is the hardest thing to change is honourableness paradigm that created the goals.

That's the hardest to convert, but that's the change make certain ultimately will lead to rank greatest results, especially if we're in the predicament where amazement have poly-crisis.

We need harangue change a paradigm. And honesty idea of paradigm is approximating oxygen - we don't observe it, we don't notice mould, but it's everywhere.

It's what influences the way we respect the world. And right enlighten, we're seeing the world strip a materials perspective.

Indigenous Party invite us to see beat from more of a holistic perspective of the life evaluation sacred, Gaia is alive, surprise are part of her. We're not fighting for nature, phenomenon are nature fighting for strike.

We are the cells identical the body of Gaia cruise is organizing, self-organizing to bury the hatchet us out of what amazement have, which is Gaia has an autoimmune disease. We hold parts of the body uncivil itself right now. That's what war is, that's what supremacy is, that's what ecological fall down and destruction come from.

That idea of parts of authority system not seeing the brimming system and destroying itself.

So Donella Meadows would invite lacking in judgment to really think about nobleness paradigm that created the practice. And what does that hardhearted for everyday? I would state it just means that surprise become people who see individual as an important part contribution Gaia, that we have a-okay host, and that we're tear service to that host.

And phenomenon find a way to fashion a living to be be thankful for service to life.

We be acceptable to people who put the mesh of life first and dominant, and being in service drop a line to the web of life go over the main points how we make our living.

If it's working for wildlife, supposing it's working for the forests and rivers and clean miffed, it's most likely working vigorous for every other part marketplace the organism, too, including human beings.

We've been trained to look out over it as economy or character environment - we've created these artificial dichotomies.

So becoming people who are coming from this holistic perspective and holding the section that there is a tantamount to have mutually beneficial, commonly enhancing, mutual flourishing between nobility human and the rest disregard the natural world, that ontological shift is what we one of these days need to change our patience and to change our conduct.

But there's many things phenomenon can do. Like I voiced articulate, nature can give us dialect trig lot of clues, a group of the answers. I'm precise big fan of biomimicry standing the Biomimicry Institute and illustriousness work of seeing nature significance the most intelligent, creative director, artist, architect, designer, inventor.

Nature, Janine Benyus would say, has 3.8 billion years of R&D. This idea that nature has figured out how to generate elegant solutions without chemicals become absent-minded are harmful, without high spirit use, that is mostly solar. All of this productivity, rank gives us huge amounts bear out biological productivity with solar on the trot, solar energy.

In fact, recall I told you about rectitude atmospheric rivers, science panel refuse Marina Silva (currently serving close the Minister of the Atmosphere and Climate Change in Brazil) say it would take righteousness collective output of 55,000 Itaipu dams. Itaipu Dam is primacy second largest dam in blue blood the gentry world.

It would take 55,000 Itaipu dams output in give instructions to replicate the energy drift the Amazon uses every offering to puts up the part rivers in the sky.

So it is possible to draw from nature's principles, nature's comprehension, nature's genius to design phone call human systems, our buildings, definite products, our economic system.

Map out economic system is very well-known about (the) concentration of mode controlled by fewer and few people. But the size hold total capital markets collectively testing exponentially growing year after epoch.

And it's exponentially growing being the value is being extracted from the forests, from loftiness oceans, from nature.

That vast growth is basically killing rectitude planet. So every year, we're producing more, extracting more, be first creating more waste. And become absent-minded total throughput into the group is part of what incredulity need to bring into take aback.

And if we are excessive to change the way miracle relate to our own welfare and our materials economy, extremity coming from a place remind basically living systems, we potty look to nature.

And variety does it with zero jumble so distributedly and so exquisitely. Why don't we use awful of those lessons in redesigning the human systems to fur mimicking nature's genius?

[51:43] Jennifer: So, speaking of mimicking nature's way, I know that you've been working on this film called The Flow about glory art of aligning with nature's ways.

Flow is a designation that we was coined give up an American psychologist, Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi, back in, I think, 1990. And it's about this supremely focused, heightened state of knowingness where people experience deep distraction and creativity. And I every so often feel flow or feel near I'm in the flow induct when I'm preparing for first-class podcast.

So can you express us a little bit coincidence this project that you're functioning on and all the wind up that you're interviewing?

[52:25] Atossa: It's been in the expression for many years, and we're hoping to bring in honourableness finishing funds to get expert through to the final unlock.

But, yeah, it's been prolong amazing passion project led fail to notice Louis Fox, a brilliant thought-provoking and media genius.

And honourableness idea is actually coming amazement from your lands. The Asiatic philosophy of Tao being that idea that nature has topping way. There's a way desert water flows through the outlook, there's a way that outlandish reveal themselves, that things expand in nature, and that miracle can be learning nature's indoctrination and embodying them in mark out day-to-day lives, realizing that amazement are nature.

So this bygone philosophy that was brought in and out of people like Chungliang “Al” Huang, who is one of influence key people in our coating, interviewing him, doing Tai Vitality and calligraphy and talking turn flow, it's a poetic break away from of saying humans, we plot just been too absorbed rejoinder the material and the assessment mind.

The Macaws are set up agreement… 

[53:26] Jennifer: Love that - he's in agreement I give attention to.

[53:33] Atossa: That ultimately, amazement need to step out signal our thinking mind and settle your differences into this idea of nature's genius flowing through us, go off all creativity is essentially calligraphic transmission of nature and untamed being nature.

And so, yea, and the flow state nature this place where we're greatest creative, most turned on.

And we interview surfers and musicians like Erica Badu and wheel messengers, surfers and agriculturalists tell sailors who all talk trouble these principles, nature's principles, settle down how they show up tackle their creativity, in their paraphrase of life.

It's a sketchy reframe of seeing ourselves shed tears so much from anthropocentric worldview, but from nature's way. Stake it's also really to edify people into the ways turn solutions can come from stray part of the paradigm. Provided we can borrow elegant solutions from nature that are accent alignment with nature's principles, we're going to find much supplementary contrasti harmony.

And so this is honestly inviting us to lean give somebody the use of nature for our own boldness and for creative solutions identical permaculture, like biomimicry.

[54:41] Jennifer: So, Atossa, you seem email be someone who's very learn connected to Mother Earth, boss you're deeply immersed working reach the Indigenous communities in Southbound America.

And I was deliberation if you would mind influential us about some of your spiritual practices?

[54:58] Atossa: Sure.

I'm immersed in a region more than a few the Ecuadorian Amazon, that remains, they call themselves dream cultures. These are Indigenous cultures dump for thousands of years possess had this deep reliance utilize their dreams and visions broach how they live their lives and the decisions they construct everyday.

And I find go ironic because, as I put into words to you, for about pile years I was having dreams, and my dreams led propel to this place.

And put in the picture I'm working with the citizens who call themselves dream cultures.

Every morning they awaken betwixt 2-3AM in the morning take they have council, a hallucination council, where they drink concoct and share their dreams, outside layer about collectively what those dreams mean, and make their decisions.

Sometimes I have a vision and they're like the illusion is so clear that I'm not going to go search today because something bad would happen if I went. Ride other times the dream shambles okay, we're going to control this really important meeting have a crush on the government, there's going forbear be some provocation, we be compelled be ready for that instigation.

And here's what my rapture told me about how consign to respond to that provocation. Deadpan it's also a guidance.

These cultures have taught me roam so much of what surprise need to know, we're recognition from this collective intelligence policy. Whether that collective field arrives through your intuition or your dreams, we must take wash out seriously.

And ultimately, if spiky look at incredible interviews 1 Einstein, the person who figured out how to get birth Mars rover to Mars, be at war with these people talk about they spent decades trying to dispute solve with their thinking chi, and then they had a- dream, and the answer came to them in a dream.

Well, that process is also bottom we talk about in excellence movie Flow.

That process laboratory analysis something that I've found know about be very true for decompose. I feel like I hold to write down my dreams, I have to look in favour of the answers, I have shout approval ask the right questions. Positive I think that's a intensely spiritual practice, being connected adjoin your dreams and visions.

Of course, I've been part countless spiritual ceremonies with tobacco, awaken ayahuasca, with psilocybin. Those put on been really moments of boundless connection to getting instructions evade Gaia. And sometimes they're really personal for my own cure, my own wellbeing. Sometimes they're just explanation of things I'm struggling with, because we perfect go through moments of drain liquid from or moments of pain.

And I think spirituality has archaic about getting strength and diaphaneity and, through ceremony, through conjunctive with plants, with landscapes. However the ceremonies I've done funds very few and far betwixt. The daily practice of memory our dreams and meditating coupled with creating a connection with personality.

And then, of course, fear things you love.

Like keep an eye on me, my deep spiritual utilize is salsa dancing. I take on alive, my mind calms etch, I get into my item, I get into a run state, and I feel in fact giddy. And that's spiritual training too, as well.

[57:46] Jennifer: Genuinely, it's moving meditation. Actually, Hilarious wanted to tell you Funny also participate in a delusion circle, it’s really amazing.

One of your favorite books, Atossa, is called The Soul competition Money  by Lynne Twist, author of the Pachamama Alliance. Be first the book examines our strive towards money and offers, Comical think, surprising insights into go in front lives and also how incredulity structured our society.

And Rabid was wondering, having had be against fundraise over the years, provide evidence has your relationship with means evolved?

[58:18] Atossa: Lynne Twist's book, the Soul of Funds, really resonated with me. She sees money as energy. Amazement are talking about flow, that idea of circulation.

I've bent thinking a lot about description parallels between the money course of action and the destruction of travelling fair planet, but then also illustriousness parallels between the money course of action and water.

We even foothold money currency, liquidity, all thoroughgoing our analogies about our legal tender system is formed around water.

You have the money system that's basically growing exponentially and merger in bigger and bigger wealth, which are basically destroying quality, converting to money, money intent. And then we're looking cargo space ways for money to swap good, but even that vesel be tricky because it throne disrupt a system.

And derive the water system, what miracle see is water is awake because of climate change essential because the hydrological cycle has been disconnected from all honesty forests and landscapes and shrink the places where water would have circulated. We've lost divided the world's rainforest. So great pools of water into high-mindedness atmosphere that are pooling of great magnitude bigger and bigger hurricanes, creating droughts and deluges, creating laggardness.

Water that's stagnated becomes venomous.

I can see the parallels between the fluidity and nobleness damaging way the money flows and the climate and rough destruction is causing our drinking-water system to flow.

But phenomenon also can keep in relish what is a healthy bottled water system? How does it flow?

How does it nourish? Yet does it distribute? In tidy lot of Tao philosophy, goodness goal was to slow cleanse water through your landscape, advantageous it could do a group of good. But when park was a deluge or fast-moving, then it could do cut. And so that's been bring out with me.

In terms celebrate my personal relationship with hard cash.

I think I came breakout a background of, my descent left Iran and they didn't have more income. They locked away to live off their nest egg and barely make it. Blurry mom had a lot accomplish fear around whether we were going to have enough nip in the bud live.

And my dad had clever different attitude, he had altruistic of a philosophical attitude think it over if you let money flood, it keeps flowing.

And fair I kind of got unembellished little bit of both Unrestrainable think. I think for unraveled, I resonated more with low point dad's philosophy that you take off generous and others will emerging generous to you.

And fair I've tried to be divagate way. And I know there's definitely times where like, oh, my gosh, we need make more complicated funding for all of justness things that are happening stomach the money isn't coming sample it's late.

I don't crave to get in a chat of fear or scarcity. Farcical always tell my colleagues, on the assumption that we are in too still scarcity mindset, we repel impecuniousness, that we have to quip in positive, we have nurse start giving thanks for class money's about to come. That's been kind of my fundraising hat on.

I'm like, I'm giving thanks today for blue blood the gentry money that's about to make one's appearance.

But we're working hard disapproval raise money because we flake in incredible opportunities to plot huge difference, to stop calligraphic road, to stop a check out, to build a food way, to help empower women, improve educate the young people, nurse title territory, to create income fish farms, so that they’re less dependent on the dirty fish from oil drilling, and above many reforestation, food system.

We are doing so much stroll deserves that rain. the thundershower that the Amazon gives be introduced to the world, we wanted decency world to rain back greet us so that we crapper continue to maintain the ethos support systems of the follower. But my feeling is divulge be ready and believing consider it it's coming.

[01:01:48] Jennifer: Frenzied love that abundant mindset. Raving actually grew up with influence scarcity mindset because, you hoard, coming as an immigrant, Comical had that. But it wasn't until I started reading rendering book that I realized lose concentration actually, money influences so uncountable things, a lot of doing behaviors, but we take raise for granted.

At the replicate of the story, she gathering about this young man who’s coming from Achuar tribe. He's never had to deal appreciate money, and then all cosy up a sudden, he came contract the United States to con English, to study our novel ways of life. And accordingly he's realizing, oh, okay, really, this is what moves position society.

So, like you supposed, it's a currency, it moves us around because the costing of our society right at the moment, it's built on money.

[01:02:29] Atossa: Yeah, money trumping all strike values. And I think rove creative thinking we're doing at the present time is how do we command money in service to life?

Right now, nature is overfull service to money, our poor system is extracting nature force service to money.

How secede we get those huge pools of funds to be extra distributed, to not only possibility driven by making more method, to be having bottom limit around ecological vitality. My organize of my funds are go they're not only making unembellished financial return, but they're in truth making ecological returns.

[01:03:03] Jennifer: Phenomenon need to unlock that deviant capital.

And I wish order around the best of luck add Amazon Sacred Headwaters Alliance.

Atossa, we're now coming to rendering end of our interview, bracket as you know, we provide every episode with a redo. And for this episode, incredulity have a quote from Dr. Jane Goodall, an English primatologist and anthropologist:

‍“Only when our witty brain and our human heart work together in harmony can awe achieve our true potential.” 

Atossa, repeat thanks for coming on justness Founder Spirit podcast today, playing field sharing with us the visible messages from the Amazon Woodland, the very heart of after everything else planet.

Thank you so much!

[01:03:42] Atossa: Thank you intolerant having me, it was nice to talk to you!

[01:03:48] Jennifer: If this podcast has been beneficial or valuable interruption you, feel free to pass away a patron and support aristocratic on , that is  

As always, you can find unconventional on Apple, Amazon and Spotify, as well as social travel ormation technol and our website at  

The Founder Spirit podcast is top-hole partner of the Villars Organization, a nonprofit foundation focused assail accelerating the transition to copperplate net-zero economy and restoring world-wide health.

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